|
|
Post by ladymcts on Jul 16, 2015 12:10:47 GMT
*sigh*
I am REALLY sad to think about breaking up the two boys who seem so bonded, and I fear a little bit how each one is going to take the separation. Jacques seems in general to do fine without Reggie, goes on about his business when I pull Reggie out of the herd for riding or hoof trimming or whatever. But Reggie will pace the fence line when his buddy is out of his sight. But there are just SO MANY reasons that moving Jacques makes a lot of sense, that I'm going to at least try it, and see how they do.
At their current facility, the boys are on probably at least 30 acres of grass half the day (I don't know the exact acreage but the farm total is 90acres with being set aside for haying). They have no trees or shelter out in that 30 acres, but do have free access to shelter back in paddocks available to them. The thing is that no matter how hot it is, Jacques is going to go out and hang with the herd, and the herd is NOT going to go hang out in a leanto with no hay, when there's plenty of grass to be had. Jacques is not dealing well with the higher temps of this more southern climate I brought him to, and I've noticed that he doesn't sweat as much as he used to. On a 90 degree day, he'll have some sweat on the chest, but no more massive salt crusts across his back and butt like he used to have. I am giving him electrolytes, which he hates, but still doesn't seem to be sweating as much as I think he should (or in comparison to Reggie).
Last year, the facility re-did the paddocks, so they were out to grass 24/7 for about 6-8 weeks. Now I can see pretty strong ridges in his hooves from that time. I didn't necessarily think he was lamnitic or foundering at the time, but clearly that diet had an impact on him.
New facility is much smaller and with stalls. So his herd will be down to about 6 (from more than 12), and he'll have a stall with fan, and turnout during the day to either a pretty dry paddock\mud area or just a couple of hours a day on grass in a much smaller area than what he's had before. One of my biggest fears in the big facility is the day that he doesn't come in pasture, how long I'll have to hunt to find him. This new place, that hunt could be <2 minutes. Old place they don't feed at all, even when I supply feed to give. New place, he gets fed 2x a day, and his stall gets picked once a day. Old place they don't blanket. New place they will blanket if warranted.
There's of course also the added benefit to me that it's going to be almost $100/mo cheaper, which will come in handy making those trailer payments. But that was actually the bottom of my checklist for why I think this is better for him.
We're going to start practicing with the trailer this weekend and see how he does ... he's always been awful about it, but as his eyesight has gotten worse, his trailering has gotten worse. He's lovely for walking in, will go in with the slightest tug of the lead line ... but then panics as soon as I try latching him in. BUT this new trailer has a front ramp for unloading which I'm hoping will be a huge help. Also got a tip from the lady I sold my old trailer to ... will install a mirror for him to look at himself while he travels!
If the trailer loading goes well, we move around the first of the month.
|
|
|
|
Post by horselover4life on Jul 16, 2015 12:32:28 GMT
Wow...many things to take into consideration.
There will be a adjustment period of time when separation takes place...you will need to give it a few weeks to see if it works honestly.
I just went through this with my Chance..mine was unsuccessful but for different reasons.
Do though check often and watch closely and carefully for those subtle changes only you who know the boys so well will detect quickly...
As for the sweating issue...electrolytes are fine to give but they don't promote sweating.
They offer a replenishment of lost elements from the sweating.
So...when I had a non-sweater issue in a rescue my vet told me to buy beer. The darker the better but any beer works. Cheapest brand you can find is fine.
Pour it on/over the feed... 1/2 to full can a day on each feeding. Whatever is in it it worked and my horse began to sweat again...thankfully.
Didn't need to keep him on it as once his body had a boost it resumed normal operations..
Maybe that will work for you too....then you could share one with the horse for medicinal reasons!!
Bottom line is you will make the right decisions for the boys because you care or you wouldn't be looking into or facing these decisions in the first place!!
 ....
|
|
|
|
Post by carshon on Jul 16, 2015 13:44:18 GMT
Lady M - you have always done what is best for your horses and I don't see how this is any different. You have obviously put a lot of thought into this and weighed out the options. If Reggie is content to be with the herd he will soon adjust to Jacques being gone. Hopefully the new facility is not too far away so you can still spent time with him. I think the new place sounds just right for retirement.
|
|
mistersmom
Junior Member
Abita Springs, LA
Posts: 3,749 
|
Post by mistersmom on Jul 16, 2015 14:14:59 GMT
Ditto what hl4l and Carshon said. You are obviously doing what is best for Jacques. Reggie will adapt, it may take a bit of time but he will. Good luck with the trailering.
|
|
|
|
Post by ladymcts on Jul 16, 2015 14:18:17 GMT
Yes, this new place is only 5 miles from home, and on the way to the closest grocery store. The owner said she does her chores in the morning, and I have somewhat frequently run to the grocery store for their 7am opening, so I think this should work well for me to get over there. I plan to get over there a much as possible the first month. When we moved 2 years ago, it took Jacques about six weeks to calm down. But I have since found that his vision is failing, so I think that was part of his issue, and something I will keep a keen eye open for with this. He may not like the dark spaces of the stalls anymore. (it seems like dusk and dark areas are worriesome for him)
Thanks for the tip on the non-sweating HL4L. I honestly JUST had the vet out here and didn't even think to ask, I've been just kind of shrugging and oh-well-he's-getting-older. Shame on me I guess. But the place he's going to, the owner said she had a true non-sweater who she used in competition, so she's very aware of how to deal with it when it's really a problem. Right now I guess I'm still in an "is it my imagination?" phase. I'll make sure she knows about his vision problems and my concerns about sweating, to see what she thinks.
|
|
|
|
Post by horselover4life on Jul 16, 2015 15:03:57 GMT
lady... there are actual products available on the market to promote non-sweaters to sweat, or to better regulate the sweat glands for cooling.
It is sometimes a inbalance or endocrine thing that creates this. Something about links to the pituitary gland functioning properly....
The technical name is "Anhidrosis"...non-sweating.
Here is a article about it and your concerns are justly placed and called for...
www.thewayofhorses.com/06_11_anhidrosis.html
One product I have heard of and was recommended also by my vet for that rescue was "One AC"
www.jefferspet.com/products/one-ac
This other product called "Pro Sweat" I have also heard about, though no first hand knowledge on it.
www.kvsupply.com/pro-sweat-10-pounds
You will do what is right for the boys.
You are such a caring owner and so tuned in to the needs and happiness of the boys it would not ever be any other way...
BTW... I use that kvsupply.com site for many of my horses and dogs needs. Great selection, fast shipping, good customer service if needed and best is a savings of $$$ for me from vet prices.
They have a pharmacy that I use for my dogs medications that saves me several hundred $$ a year!! 
 ...
|
|
redzip
Junior Member
Posts: 1,701
|
Post by redzip on Jul 17, 2015 0:58:37 GMT
Sorry you are having to move Jacques, but it honestly sounds like a well thought out plan,
given his issues.
Any reason why you can't board both horses there?
I wish, when it was time to retire me, someone would send me to such a lovely facility!! apple
Keep us posted, and best of luck.
|
|
|
|
Post by ladymcts on Jul 17, 2015 3:18:24 GMT
Redzip - this new facility is a very small private family farm with very few horses. No indoor\outdoor arena, no trails, no trailer parking. It's basically going to be a nice retirement place, but not someplace I would want to keep a riding horse.
Then there's the complicated issue of the fact that I'm renting a house from the people who own the "old" barn where both horses have been until now. I really love being only 1/2 mile away from the boys, able to see them in the morning with binoculars from my windows in the winter mornings (too many trees in summer), and they have a massive indoor arena that makes riding possible year round. So while I do have a few bones to pick about it not being the perfect place for boarding, overall it still feels like the right place to leave Reggie. And the fact that I rent the house from them makes me feel somewhat morally obligated to keep a horse with them, altho technically they are two separate leases not tied to each other.
|
|
|
|
Post by horselady on Jul 17, 2015 11:18:24 GMT
Sorry you are going to do this, but we all know it will be best for him. have you thought of cushings? the regulation of body temp is difficult if they have it. difficult decisions we make for the love of our horses. he has come a long way in your care and he will be ok in the retirement place also.
|
|
nhg
Junior Member
Posts: 2,429
|
Post by nhg on Jul 19, 2015 3:06:42 GMT
It sounds like a wonderful retirement facility for him, good for you! So horses in really hot weather just sweat while they're hanging out in the field? Our summers can get quite hot but not that hot. I didn't know this was the case. It's interesting to me.
|
|
hugs
Junior Member
Posts: 2,647
|
Post by hugs on Jul 27, 2015 13:31:58 GMT
I just found this thread and was reading when Gerald said he needed to check out CL so, I'll be back!
|
|
|
|
Post by ladymcts on Jul 28, 2015 2:22:24 GMT
If all goes well, I should be moving him on Thursday night. What might not go well, you ask? Well ....
Turns out I'm lucky my rig didn't incinerate me and my pretty new trailer. I had a "leaking valve" near the fuel filter that was spilling diesel onto the engine block. It's covered under warranty and being remedied SOON I hope. I was told the part would get there today, but no call saying it's ready, so I'll call in the morning. Funny thing is that I didn't have a problem before having the fuel filter changed, and I do have fuel leaking all around the filter, not just at a single point leading into or out of it. So I'm calling BS and saying they screwed up when they changed my filter.
Anyhoo ... all that means that I didn't get to practice loading with Jacques over the weekend, and I won't have time to practice before Thursday, so we'll just have to try it and see how he does. In the past I've always managed to get him loaded when it really mattered. It's when I pussy-foot around trying to "practice" that we have the worst sessions.
|
|
hugs
Junior Member
Posts: 2,647
|
Post by hugs on Jul 28, 2015 2:36:51 GMT
Diesel fuel isn't combustible like gasoline so you were in no danger of going up in flames.
|
|
|
|
Post by ladymcts on Aug 2, 2015 1:16:03 GMT
Well, this isn't turning out so well after all. I've had two honest tries at trailer loading and a complete failure each time. Good old clydemonster is back with a vengeance. He knows that he can overpower me, and I'm reluctant to damage my trailer. SEcond try was even using a product called Tryptodex, hoping a mild calming agent could help. Nope, couldn't see any difference at all. So today we went back to what I know best, which is lead him into the trailer and let him relax. If he starts backing himself out, then he gets pushed out and worked. But it's killing me to work him, because I can see he's ouchy on each of his front feet. So I was mixing it up with circle left, circle right, turn left, turn right, back up, everything I could think of to make him work. And my concerns about him not sweating were either realized, or I wasn't working him hard enough. I finally quit after two hours and him heaving and blowing pretty good.
Next up, placing a call to the vet to see about a sedative. I positively loathe to go that route, and I will keep working at the "let's get in here calm and relaxed" by feeding him in the trailer each night, but I fear the sedation route will be the best approach given his physical ailments.
|
|
|
|
Post by horselover4life on Aug 2, 2015 11:26:11 GMT
I hear you Lady and feel the pain too.
Those that have "good" loading horses... they don't quite understand what it is like to not have one. 
I now have two that are so-so loaders.... 
One that is point at any trailer and he is in and stands like a rock!! 
Training and perseverance only get you so far when the brain is as thick as some are I believe... 
We get it and then we don't..... 
You mention feeding him in the trailer...
Can you feed him his morning rations in it then he is in and you only need to lock up the back then his head and off you go?
Would that work???
And you know you have to get a scratch and dent on any new trailer... just the way it is! 
|
|
|
|
Post by lorddaxter on Aug 2, 2015 12:27:26 GMT
It sounds like a wonderful retirement facility for him, good for you! So horses in really hot weather just sweat while they're hanging out in the field? Our summers can get quite hot but not that hot. I didn't know this was the case. It's interesting to me. Really?.....mine have been sweated up a few times just standing in the field this summer already, it has been more humid this year so far, maybe that doesnt help? |
|
|
|
Post by lorddaxter on Aug 2, 2015 12:28:56 GMT
Agree with hl4l, try feeding him in it, always worked for me along with a pressure halter and tickle stick with plastic bag in bad cases, but you need someone else for the tickle stick
|
|
hugs
Junior Member
Posts: 2,647
|
Post by hugs on Aug 2, 2015 13:26:26 GMT
As you know it isn't about the trailer. It isn't about anything at all except the safety of Mr. Jacques the Less Than Intrepid Explorer. But here is a question; Is he scared or is this him asserting his choices over yours? If he's scared then maybe you don't need to work him, but allow him to calm down and then try again. And do you back him out before he starts to back out or do you follow him out? Perhaps if he knew you'd let him out before he wanted to go out you could be the one to decide how much time he spends in there. Oh just thought of another question. Are you doing this trailer loading to get him to go somewhere or as a lesson? There is a big difference in your intention which he can tell. You can do several trailer loading lessons separated by other lessons, like "touch your nose to this carrot behind your shoulder", or something else that doesn't involve him walking on gravel.
Otherwise if sedation is what keeps him safe and he has got to go to this other facility before your trailer loading lessons "work", then do what's safe for him. There is no win or lose, there is only safety and maintaining your relationship with him.
|
|
|
|
Post by horselady on Aug 2, 2015 20:11:18 GMT
lI hope he decides to go in for you. and perhaps if all else fails have someone with an open stock trailer come and get him , i have a feeling he might see that box as too small. again if he is the only one going in the trailer take the divider out and give him room.
hate rough loaders. hubby back the trailer up to the aisleway and uses a rake over the butt like a big bird . they hop in an never look back.
hope you can get him in.
|
|
|
|
Post by horselover4life on Aug 2, 2015 23:14:41 GMT
lI hope he decides to go in for you. and perhaps if all else fails have someone with an open stock trailer come and get him , i have a feeling he might see that box as too small. again if he is the only one going in the trailer take the divider out and give him room. hate rough loaders. hubby back the trailer up to the aisleway and uses a rake over the butt like a big bird . they hop in an never look back.hope you can get him in.
Ummmm, no! wag finger
So we have a bright red dressage whip with a short popper {looks more like a driving whip to me actually}
We ask once, twice... then we get "the whip" and he knows no more nonsense and on he goes. He just sees the thing and on he goes in a hurry, never touched him nor even popped it!
Once in he is fine but before I can even do the butt chain a plopping mess of wet, runny poop greets my floor. {gross} 
Duke has only been on our trailer one time...
He broke my leather halter flying backward. {think he got scared though}
We will start trail riding soon and will be using a nylon halter {much as I hate them} under his leather one with shanks attached to both... secured with the leather one but if he pulls back and breaks it again then he can't get loose and run.
IF he pulls back he and I will have trailer loading and pull-back lessons he won't be forgetting....
Feel for you lady....
Your boys are just "slightly" larger than mine are {a large size difference}
What we can get our horses to do fairly easily may take some extra for you to accomplish as your guys are so much larger and stronger but still that pea brain...
757724.. You are NOT going to out-muscle them so it is outsmart them time!!
Bribery is easier than a war and I sure do pick my battles carefully if I must fight with them.... mini-graphics-smileys-026108
Be careful.....
|
|
....
...
