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Post by lorddaxter on Dec 19, 2014 13:51:12 GMT
It never hurts to get a second opinion and it will be a great opportunity for you to get to know the vets in your area and find one you like when you can do so calmly and not in an emergency. The clinic I use has at least 4 vets. They are all great and nice and I would happily use any of them in an emergency but for non-emergency appointments, I ask for my favorite (he's oh so dreamy...). Actually if the emergency is during normal hours, I ask for him as well - if feasible. LOL!......  ......you should plan an emergency for New Years eve! |
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mistersmom
Junior Member
Abita Springs, LA
Posts: 3,749 
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Post by mistersmom on Dec 19, 2014 15:08:42 GMT
I don't think his wife would appreciate that!
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Post by horselady on Dec 19, 2014 16:39:28 GMT
I have 8 vets in the office i use and 4 of them better not set foot on my farm unless they are with another one in a real emergency. wonder what is that herbal stuff? read the ingredients. you are better off getting probios and dropping it in his sweet feed.
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Post by horselady on Dec 19, 2014 16:42:01 GMT
I have 8 vets in the office i use and 4 of them better not set foot on my farm unless they are with another one in a real emergency. wonder what is that herbal stuff? read the ingredients. you are better off getting probios and dropping it in his sweet feed. and if you feel not comfortable with the visit than by all means find someone who will devote their attention to you 100 percent.
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Post by mustangsavvy on Dec 19, 2014 19:25:34 GMT
A second opinion is always worth it - in my opinion. Good luck finding a vet you like. It is certainly a process.
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Post by Shelly on Dec 20, 2014 1:42:58 GMT
I'm surprised she didn't recommend omeprazole as specially since you think it's a stomach issue.
What is in the herbal stuff?? I asked one of my vets about giving Gracie herbal stuff for the joins and she told me she wasn't convinced it would really make a difference but this is for founder so I'm curious to see what this stuff is.
What are his current symptoms??
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 6:11:55 GMT
Fecal and sand test came back normal.
Bloodwork also came back and he is well within normal ranges. Her advice was basically to finish him up on the herbal stuff and not worry about it.
I will grab a list of what's in this stuff tomorrow when I go visit him. Benny still really isn't into eating it, and I would rather have him on a probiotic anyway.
The odd thing is that the loose stool / diarrhea is the only real discernible symptom right now. Frequent elimination as well maybe as he does poop more than any other horse I have owned, but this too seems to be a fairly recent development.
He eats and drinks well, is excited for his hay and gets a lot of it. Good gut sounds, no sensetive areas or colicky behaviour. Always has good capillary refill and skin pinch results. I don't really think he has any other symptoms. This is not to say I am not inadvertently overlooking something, but that was half the goal of having the vet out in the first place. It is confusing and frustrating for me.
Probably won't be able to get another vet out until after the holidays, and I want to hold off starting omprezole until then. In the meantime daily bum/ leg washes with Vaseline and this herbal stuff in his feed.
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Post by horselover4life on Dec 20, 2014 12:29:18 GMT
I asked my vet who stopped by to say hello yesterday when he saw me riding...picked his educated mind. {no, he did not mind he said, I did ask first!}
I love my vet, I do I do!!
He asked if you had had blood-work of protein and PCV levels done, need to be specifically asked for not in a routine panel.
I was not sure exactly whether these needed special asking to be done but he said bloods for IR, ulcers, colitis, malabsorption syndrome and hepatitis he would be screening for or out.
I asked about "alfalfa hay" causing this...he said sometimes some horses react that it is to much protein which causes upset and they just can't digest it well.
He offered beet pulp as a possible partial alternative to richer hays.
He also said here bacteria are in the round rolls, regardless of dry when rolled it is there so that could be a culprit of yours too if horse is on round rolls. The bacteria could be salmonella in low dose/grade...something else to look for.
In some places available is "tuff hay"....he said do some research and see if this may be a possible choice for you.
Probiotics, absolutely yes he should be on them....they will help to return his gut to a balanced bacteria/flora he needs.
Stress is a biggie that could be causing this too. I told him about the injury, he raised his eyebrows and said it probably has a part of the equation, so maybe something supplemental to help reduce or manage that stress overload the horse is still feeling even if you aren't detecting.
He also told me that you can feed "marshmallow powder"...a natural digestive aid that has been found to help reduce, prevent colic & dehydration in some horses. He said if interested google it as he is unaware of where you could find it in Canada...here in the USA it is available online.
Oh,he gave me to reference articles for you to read if you have not. He said many use smart-pak and they have great reference articles....
blog.smartpakequine.com/2012/07/what-to-do-about-horses-with-diarrhea/
thalequine.com/intestinal-health-and-colitis-in-adult-horses/
So, some other ideas or things to try....
He also seconded another vet if the one YOU PAID FOR was more interested in socializing than helping to diagnose your horse!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2014 16:01:04 GMT
Thank you SO much for thinking of Benny and I when your vet dropped by.
I found a clinic in the area that specializes in horses and will be sure to ask for those blood test specifically. The blood we did was just a routine panel.
I am also going to talk to the girl who does the feeding if I can get a hay sample so I can have it tested for bacteria and protein. Great ideas.
I had also considered that stress was likely a factor here, with the move and the injury. I will be doing some research on stress reduction supplements and therapy's today.
Lots of great ideas and researching for me today! Thank you so much Hl4L!!!
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Post by horselover4life on Dec 20, 2014 20:15:13 GMT
Remember Apollo that every time the round bale or load of hay changes so may the bacteria count and source.....you know this already.
It would be good to know but for how long does he have the "exact same feed source of hay and eating conditions..."
Now that you found what sounds to be a better fit for health care for Benny I wonder if there is anything else or anything different done for horses in your climate than down here in warmth and humidity and no  ...
I hope the answers are soon in coming for Benny and you....
Have you thought to contact his previous owner and inquire if he had any episodes like this under their care....maybe there is a pattern or they know a way to maintain and control this ....
884530............
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mistersmom
Junior Member
Abita Springs, LA
Posts: 3,749
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Post by mistersmom on Dec 22, 2014 14:03:34 GMT
I think I remember you saying this all started when they gave Benny a new bale of hay. If that is correct, has he finished that bale yet? Just curious. Lots of good info from hl4l and her vet!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2014 15:55:18 GMT
Yes, I did suspect initially that this was something to do with going from one bale to the next. He has finished that bale and is part way through another one. After having watched him more closely in the past few weeks, I am starting to think this is less likely a hay issue and more likely a digestive one. I did call his old owner \ trainer, and well as his groom from the track and they both said he never had issues like this before. I believe them, they were both very upfront during the buying process about everything that could even possibly be considered wrong with him, right down to the fact he had bite marks from being turned out. I also enquired about what sort of hay he was on and it was an alfalfa and brome mixture, so I am now less inclined to think the hay is causing this. I also noticed yesterday that his coat is noticeably more dull than other horses in the barn. This leads me to think this is a internal issue now. The herbal stuff does actually seem to be helping somewhat. He is still loose, but not as much so as he has been. New vet is coming out Jan 7th, so we have to wait it out until then. I bought some Grand Digest and will be slowly starting him on that as well. I have a gut feeling this is ulcers, but I want to see what the next vet says. It would make sense as he has been through a lot for a three year old. Track then coming to Calgary crammed into a little trailer, then everything with the neighbors at the old place, moving again (albeit a much more positive hauling experience this time) and then the attack. Poor dude has been through a lot in the last 6 months.  |
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Post by mustangsavvy on Dec 22, 2014 16:51:48 GMT
It sounds like ulcers to me, especially with a OTTB. Hope the new vet is more helpful for you!
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Post by horselady on Dec 22, 2014 21:15:16 GMT
If you think it is ulcers or perhaps a side effect of heartburn than perhaps an over the counter tagemet or hearburn medication will help with coating his stomach.
hope you find the ans .
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2015 21:13:46 GMT
Just thought I would update this before the new vet is out tomorrow.
Much to my surprise, the herbal stuff appears to be working! Benny hasn't had a really bad day since my last update. His tail and legs have been clean for the most part and he doesn't defecate as frequently. (Once, maybe twice when I have him in; down from 4-5 times in the same time frame)
Still no other outward symptoms, so we are still going to run all the tests suggested above. I held off starting him on the Grand Digest at the recommendation of the Vet. He also didn't think this herbal stuff would have any marginal effect, but he figured the Grand Digest would.
He is still duller than I would like despite frequent grooming, but hopefully that will resolve itself with whatever issue we have going on right now.
He has also finished the roundbale he was eating late in December and started a new one with out any noticeable changes.
Will post again tomorrow after the vet has been.
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Post by lorddaxter on Jan 6, 2015 22:11:14 GMT
That's good news, it does annoy me though when you just don't know what the cause is, hope you discover something meantime:)
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......you should plan an emergency for New Years eve!
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